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alaskaone
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Date Posted:02/19/2012 6:28 AMCopy HTML

The USFS says 'global warming' is killing off yellow cedars in S.E. Alaska and B.C., Canada by causing their roots to freeze due to lack of snow cover.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46439567/ns/us_news-environment/

In S.E. Alaska, there is very little soil and what soil there is, is very nutrient poor and doesn't hold water very well.  It can rain for 40 days straight there but 4 hours after the sun comes out, you'll have dust blowing in your face.  Snow on the ground type winter is usually 3 months or so in Juneau and about two months in Ketchikan.

You should also know that trees in this part of the world don't have tap roots because... well, under the inch or two of 'soil' we have up here is solid rock.  This entire part of the world emerged out from under glaciers and ice fields about 12,000 years ago... not enough time to build up soil.

The theory that lack of snow cover causes the roots to freeze is kinda goofy.  The root wad of cedar trees isn't that much larger than the diameter of their branches... I know this because I've seen them after they have fallen over in high winds.  Additionally, coniferous trees shed snow pretty well.  Alaskans know if you are stranded in the bush in the snow, nice shelter can be found at the base of coniferous trees because the snow that sheds off the tree builds a nice wall around the base... once you're inside there, you are well sheltered.

Generally speaking, the world makes sense.  Things happen for reasons that are generally not that hard to figure out.  So when a group of 'scientists' tell me something that makes no obvious sense... is it not reasonable to question their results?
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #31
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:06/09/2013 10:23 PMCopy HTML

Reply to alaskaone (06/08/2013 9:05 PM)

Reply to Aprildaze (06/08/2013 6:12 AM)

Why did I post about birth control in a global warming thread?   


Perhaps because so many AGW alarmists are also 'over population' alarmists?

Welcome back, btw.


Thank you for noticing I was gone.  My used computer tower crashed.  That's twice in 6 months.  This time I bought a new tower with lots more ram, and much, much speedier; with a built in virus protection and free tech help for 15 months.  And it cost a little more than the used tower.  Be that a lesson.



Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #32
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:06/11/2013 3:43 AMCopy HTML

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/11/science/earth/what-to-make-of-a-climate-change-plateau.html?_r=0

If you've read through that article, you might notice that what the times accuses us 'skeptics' of doing is exactly what we 'skeptics' accuse them of doing.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #33
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/29/2013 10:50 AMCopy HTML

Over the years, 'science' has presented quite a lot of 'facts' that are, at best, questionable.  I've often wondered, 'why'?  After all, science is supposed to be all about facts... facts that are verified by other scientists.

I can understand new information coming to light that alters understanding.  That's awesome... exactly what 'science' should be.... willing to examine old 'truths' in the light of new information and understanding.

But that doesn't explain what's been going on in some of the more 'fluffy' branches of science... psychology, psychiatry, enviromental science, economics... and more.

This, however, might.  Science Has Lost Its Way - Michael Hiltzik, Los Angeles Times
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
Punkoidragon Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #34
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/29/2013 12:14 PMCopy HTML

science is made by scientists......who are people.....who often have preconcieved thoughts that they seek to prove rather than just looking at the facts beforehand.


It has been that way for as long as there has been thought.
Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #35
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/29/2013 2:01 PMCopy HTML

Yep science has accomplised absolutely zero.
Punkoidragon Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #36
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/29/2013 10:33 PMCopy HTML

of course anyone who isn't mentally retarded or blinded by political agenda would realize that "just because some scientists said so" doesn't automatically make it true and that doesn't make all science false, just a tendency for popular modern science to be tainted by political, religious, and idealogical bias. 

some accepted scientific ideas of today were regaurded as heresy, and contradicted the popular, accepted state owned scientists of the past.
Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #37
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/30/2013 1:51 AMCopy HTML

I never said they always get it right, there is to much undiscovered isn't it obvious what science has brought?
Punkoidragon Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #38
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/30/2013 2:23 AMCopy HTML

yes, it's also obvious that when science is used by religion or a government to "prove" an official policy is when it's used the most for disgusting evil. 

when theres a hot-topic and a scientist comes out with "proof" of one side or the other, be wary, no matter how many pages of data they can shovel at us. .
Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #39
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/30/2013 2:50 AMCopy HTML

I do understand that, eggs will not kill you. You weed out what does not make common sense but at the end of the day whether it be the science of medicine, space, archeology, tech, you have to give them credit where credit is due.
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #40
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/30/2013 4:14 AMCopy HTML

The problem here isn't that some research is bogus... it's the extent of the bogus-isity.

The idea was to make sure that research on which Amgen was spending millions of development dollars still held up. They figured that a few of the studies would fail the test — that the original results couldn't be reproduced because the findings were especially novel or described fresh therapeutic approaches.

But what they found was startling: Of the 53 landmark papers, only six could be proved valid.

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hiltzik-20131027,0,1228881.column#axzz2j6eWxCuj



Six out of 53 papers were valid?

Kinda a lot, don't you think?

Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #41
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:10/30/2013 1:55 PMCopy HTML

Yep so is the money and guinea pigs. The article is mistaken overall doctors dopay attention to what is published in their field, they have no choice. The majority of drugs flogged by the pharmaceutical companies often sit on shelves unused. Doctors are more skeptical/cautious  about studies, published articles and new drugs than you think. Unless it is like the HRT study, 10,000 women over 10years and double blind. If you read any of these published studies/articles it is noted that many have few persons in them and were short term, they are automatically tossed out and many make no common sense to the medical profession, it's really not that difficult to get published, unfortunately.
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #42
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:03/17/2015 3:44 AMCopy HTML

Been a while since we visited 'stupid science'...


If you’re a man who smiles at women and makes an effort to be kind to them, you’re probably an “insidious” and “treacherous” sexist, according to a study conducted by researchers from Northeastern University in Boston. Seriously. After observing 27 people playing Trivial Pursuit, the researchers determined that these kind of behaviors — previously known as “chivalry” — were actually signs of what’s called “benevolent sexism.” In other words: Men who think that women deserve to be treated well often also think that women should be treated particularly well because they’re women. This, they explain, perpetuates gender inequality. Offering your jacket to a shivering women isn’t helping her — it’s hurting her by perpetuating the patriarchal idea that a woman is more likely to be cold than you are just because she’s a woman. Other warning signs of “benevolent sexism” include being friendly and chatty to women — which head researcher Jin Goh said is in some ways worse than being mean and/or straight up ignoring them: “Sexism can appear very friendly and very welcoming, so in the paper we said that sexism can act like a wolf in sheep’s clothing,” Goh said, according to an article in the Washington Post. “We add that sexism can consciously or unconsciously cloak itself in friendliness, so in a way it’s more insidious and treacherous than hostile sexism.”

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/415256/study-being-nice-women-sign-sexism-katherine-timpf

We men are strong, violent critters.  Attacking the codes of behavior that make us civilized is... stupid.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #43
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:03/18/2015 4:33 AMCopy HTML

Have you heard of the giant plastic island in the Pacific Ocean? Several times in casual conversation, I've been told that mankind is ruining the oceans to such an extent that there are now entire islands of plastic waste. Daily Kos tells us that this "island" is twice the size of Texas!

This struck me as incredible, in the most literal sense of the word, so I decided to look into the claim.

...

The global network of ocean currents will sweep up floating debris and push it towards certain locations. Around the earth, this debris accumulates in regions called gyres, where a current vortex will tend to push suspended matter into a central area and trap it. There are major gyres in the North and South Atlantic and Pacific and the Indian Ocean.

Outside of those five major gyre regions, plastic density is very low and sometimes effectively zero when measured.

Scientific studies measure the amount of plastic present in the gyres by trawling through with enormous nets. The method is painstaking and subject to variation due to differences in mesh sizes of nets, trawling speed of the boat, the diligence of the measuring researchers and other variables.

A well-known 2001 study measured the density of plastic debris in the world's largest gyre, in the North Pacific. They found roughly 5 kg of plastic per square kilometer. This abstract figure is easier to handle when you break it down into a more fathomable number. In an area the size of an Olympic regulation swimming pool, this amounts to roughly two bottle caps' worth of plastic.

A 2013 study conducted in the South Pacific gyre found that plastic density there was 100 times lower than the North Pacific. That's one plastic bottle cap in roughly 50 Olympic pools.

This bottle cap analogy is not entirely correct either. Most of the plastic is actually broken down into microscopic bits or films suspended in the seawater at varying depths. They are mostly invisible to the naked eye. It's like you took the bottle caps and ground them into particles finer than sand.

So, here are the facts. Much of the ocean contains little to no plastic at all. In the smaller ocean gyres, there is roughly one bottle cap of plastic per 50 Olympic swimming pools' worth of water. In the worst spot on earth, there is about two plastic caps' worth of plastic per swimming pool of ocean. The majority of the plastic is ground into tiny grains or small thin films, interspersed with occasional fishing debris such as monofilament line or netting. Nothing remotely like a large island exists.

http://www.realclearscience.com/blog/2015/03/giant_plastic_island_fact_or_fiction.html

Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #44
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:03/20/2015 5:14 PMCopy HTML

On the article about chivalry, a study of 27 playing trivial pursuit, I can't think of a more trivial study. Why don't they just ask us what we think? It"s few and far  between that I find women of any age group who doesn't enjoy chivalry. Forget the studies, some things should be left.
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #45
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:07/09/2015 7:42 AMCopy HTML

Last year was Alaska’s hottest ever recorded. Alaska has warmed twice as fast as other states. Alaskans are already worried about how melting permafrost will damage the state’s transportation infrastructure—permafrost is supposed to be permanent, and northerners build roads on it. It’s also a unique habitat for animals and plants.

Alaska Is on Fire - Sarah Zhang, Wired

Sorry... an Alaskan here.  We're not actually "on fire".  It's summer and in the summer we have forest fires.  Always have and always will.

Additionally, the "hottest ever recorded" phrase is highly misleading.  What we've been experiencing is winters that are less cold.  That may seem like the same thing but really it's not.   Our summers are pretty much the same temps they've always been, it's the winters that have been warmer and drier.  For example, a couple decades ago, -40F was the rule during january/february.  We haven't had temps that low in a long time... this winter, the lowest I saw was 10F., if I recall correctly.

Less severe winters raise the average.. we're not getting warmer so much as we're getting less cold.

Lastly... permafrost.  We built roads on it cause we had no choice and every spring we paid for it... frost heaves.  Some frost heaves were so bad that villages would park the city bulldozer next to the worst ones so that when people got their cars stuck in them, they could just hop in the bulldozer and drag the car out.

Oh.. and animals do not live in permafrost.  They just don't.  They try to live on top of it and every spring when the stuff starts melting, they suffer the consequences... they have to slog through mosquito infested muck until it dries up a bit.  Break up used to last for weeks... now?  I haven't seen a real frost heave in years.

Granted, Wired isn't a scientific journal but it would be nice if Sarah Zhang made an attempt to talk to Alaskans before writing about us.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
Punkoidragon Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #46
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:07/09/2015 11:35 AMCopy HTML

 I wonder what percentage of facts quoted by blogge....er...um journalists are actual facts.  


When someone is talking about global warming and you mention to them that we've only been able to take truely accurate measurements for about 50 years.  Then tell them they've found vineyards buried under the ice in greenland because it used to be much warmer there hundreds of years ago, and there was a 10 year long winter during the 1600's......their eyes glaze over......can't....hear.....facts....nooooooo.....


and yeah, in a study watching 27 people play a board game somebody made an observation that in nooo Way had any bias.  Now it's in the annals of science.   

Aren't you supposed to just observe first and write down what you see?  not go looking for your pet peeve and then shriek "science" once you find a way to create it?  opps, i've confused science with racist male chauvinism. 



Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #47
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:07/28/2015 7:16 AMCopy HTML

Stephen Hawking, Elon Musk, Steve Wozniak and over 1,000 AI researchers co-signed an open letter to ban killer robots

These are all smart people and they are also all examples of how smart people can be stupid.

Yes, maybe some day an AI might be smart enough to break programming.  So?  A drone might kill the wrong target (like that doesn't happen every fucking day already)... but then what?  It runs out of fuel and crashes.

What about a "terminator"?  Same problem... runs out of gas.

We do not have an energy source capable of running any machine more than a few hours... except nuclear reactors... which means electricity which means our "terminator" has a range of about 200 feet... the longest extension cord out there at the moment.

Arnold becomes slightly less frightening when he has to worry about untangling his extension cord or accidentally unplugging himself. 

Ahnold:  "I'll be ba....."
Civilian 1:  "What?  I'll be, what?"
Civilian 2:  "Looks like he's unplugged'.
Civilian 1:  Should we plug him back in?
Civilian 2:  Why does a person have an electrical cord hanging out his butt?
Civilian 1:  Maybe it's not a big, Austrian dude?  Maybe it's a killer robot from the future?
Civilian 2:  Maybe.  It's a door stop, now.
Civilian 1:  Cool!

What about nuclear powered warships... like carriers?

What about them?  Without people, carriers are helpless and it requires hundreds of people to operate.  That's a lot of tangled up extension cords for our terminators.

Don't get me wrong.  I love smart people.  I'm not one, but I sincerely admire and respect intelligent people... the world would be a poor place without them.

But sometimes... ya just want to fish slap 'em.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #48
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 3:50 PMCopy HTML

The launch of the clinicaltrials.gov registry in 2000 seems to have had a striking impact on reported trial results, according to a PLoS ONE study1 that many researchers have been talking about online in the past week.

A 1997 US law mandated the registry’s creation, requiring researchers from 2000 to record their trial methods and outcome measures before collecting data. The study found that in a sample of 55 large trials testing heart-disease treatments, 57% of those published before 2000 reported positive effects from the treatments. But that figure plunged to just 8% in studies that were conducted after 2000. Study author Veronica Irvin, a health scientist at Oregon State University in Corvallis, says this suggests that registering clinical studies is leading to more rigorous research. Writing on his NeuroLogica Blog, neurologist Steven Novella of Yale University in New Haven, Connecticut, called the study “encouraging” but also “a bit frightening” because it casts doubt on previous positive results.

Irvin and her co-author Robert Kaplan, chief science officer at the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality in Rockville, Maryland, focused on human randomized controlled trials that were funded by the US National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute (NHLBI). The authors conclude that registration of trials seemed to be the dominant driver of the drastic change in study results. They found no evidence that the trend could be explained by shifting levels of industry sponsorship or by changes in trial methodologies.

Irvin says that by having to state their methods and measurements before starting their trial, researchers cannot then cherry-pick data to find an effect once the study is over. “It’s more difficult for investigators to selectively report some outcomes and exclude others,” she says.

cont... http://www.nature.com/news/registered-clinical-trials-make-positive-findings-vanish-1.18181


I'm not attacking 'science' so much as suggesting that treating 'science' as infallible is 'anti' everything that science stands for.

Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 4:09 PMCopy HTML

I believe one of the articles might be a bit late clinical trials world wide have had to be registered for a decade internationally.
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 5:02 PMCopy HTML

Well, yes.  That was mentioned.

The point was that 'science' is susceptible to the same foibles any other human endeavor is subject to.  In real science, there is no such concept as 'the science is settled'.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #51
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 5:14 PMCopy HTML

Some things are settled, many are not probably won't ever be. Scientists like many of us just try their best, that's about all we can do with what we have at the moment as time marches on more and more is discovered in all sciences.
WRS10 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #52
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 7:30 PMCopy HTML

http://reason.com/archives/2012/10/02/half-of-the-facts-you-know-are-probably

A review of The Half-Life of Facts: Why Everything We Know Has an Expiration Date by Samuel Arbesman.


..............In other words, half of what physicians thought they knew about liver diseases was wrong or obsolete 45 years later. As interesting and persuasive as this example is, Arbesman’s book would have been strengthened by more instances drawn from the scientific literature.............
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #53
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/16/2015 7:59 PMCopy HTML

Reply to katie5445 (08/16/2015 8:14 AM)

Some things are settled, many are not probably won't ever be.

Nothing in science is ever settled, Katie.  If, tomorrow, someone discovers that gravity is, in fact, generated by worms, and that discovery is verified by other researchers, then everything we thought we knew will be thrown out.

Scientists like many of us just try their best, that's about all we can do with what we have at the moment as time marches on more and more is discovered in all sciences.

Isn't that what I said?
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/17/2015 3:32 PMCopy HTML

But I said some was settled, science is a broad subject, there are things that are settled but I will not list them as I'm sure you will have some type of way to argue it and I'm not in the mood, I'm going on a short vacation with the whole family to the beach tomorrow. smiley29
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/17/2015 7:33 PMCopy HTML

The topic of settled science is a complicated one. You see, science doesn’t deal in proofs (with the exception of mathematical proofs in certain areas of physics). Rather, it deals in probabilities. In other words, it tells us what is most likely true, but it does not tell us what is absolutely true. It is inherently incapable of proving anything with 100% certainty because we are inherently incapable of knowing everything, which means that we always have to acknowledge the possibility that there is some other piece of evidence which eludes us. Another way to think about this is that science tells us what is correct given the current evidence, but it cannot completely eliminate the possibility of unknown evidence. So in the strictest sense, there is not such thing as “settled science.” It is always possible that some new discovery will overturn previous ideas, but, and this is the really important part, that doesn’t give you the right the assume that other evidence is out there. In other words, the fact that something technically might be wrong, doesn’t mean that you can assume it is wrong (that would be logical blunder known as an argument from ignorance fallacy).

Is Science Ever Actually Settled? - The Logic of Science
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/18/2015 2:47 PMCopy HTML

That missed certain points of science, there is fact, deductive inference, inductive inference, hypothesis and theory. Copernicus, Newton, Einstein, Darwin have based theories on certain facts. I know for a fact the earth is not flat..............
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/26/2015 8:03 PMCopy HTML

Will Co2, H2O or CO ever have any more or less atoms?
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/27/2015 4:21 AMCopy HTML

Reply to katie5445 (08/26/2015 11:03 AM)

Will Co2, H2O or CO ever have any more or less atoms?

More or fewer atoms turns them into different things.  This can happen naturally and it can be done deliberately.

Nuclear transmutation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/27/2015 7:05 PMCopy HTML

Let's stick to natural instead of nuclear change and artificial change. 
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Re:When science is stupid.

Date Posted:08/28/2015 8:32 AMCopy HTML

Humans aren't natural?

Well, let that go. 

Sure, things gain and lose atoms from a variety of events... heat, pressure, solar and cosmic radiation, combustion, etc.  Iron become iron oxide when it rusts.  Copper gets that green crap on it.  Silver tarnishes.  Lightning changes the air into other gasses.

And every couple billion years, stuff gets plowed back into the mantle as tectonic plates do their thing and dive back in.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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