In reply to This is $50M of private …by EndOfDayExit
|
| Title: Why Capitalism doesn't work! | |
| TAEmove > General > General Discussion | Go to subcategory： |
| Author | Content |
|
Knightly
|
|
|
Date Posted：05/27/2018 4:02 PMCopy HTML The following is a list of just some of the major retailers that are closing stores in 2018…
thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
WRS10
|
Share to:
#1
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：05/27/2018 5:56 PMCopy HTML That is just one form of retail being replaced by another. That is how capitalism works.
|
Hayekian
|
Share to:
#2
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：05/27/2018 8:03 PMCopy HTML I agree with WRS - this is precisely why capitalism works far better than socialism or any other known economic system, as ineffective businesses fail and are replaced by more effective businesses that better serve consumers. That is the principle of "creative destruction" at work - " … Creative destruction refers to the incessant product and process innovation mechanism by which new production units replace outdated ones. It was coined by Joseph Schumpeter (1942), who considered it 'the essential fact about capitalism'. …" This is how capitalism puts economic resources to better use. Compare this to poorly operating facets of government - where taxes and costs continuously go up, and service goes down. When consumers have a choice, they choose options that better satisfy their needs, at lower cost - leading to higher economic efficiency.
Comment: Part of the present problem in Washington is the lack of compromise.
Response: It's always better for the bully when the bullied does not resist, isn't it?
|
|
tommytalldog
|
Share to:
#3
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：05/30/2018 12:41 PMCopy HTML
Way back when the roads were bad & the tinker went from here to there with his wares in a covered wagon. Then came the traveling salesman in his business coupe displaying his goods to the folks in the hinterland, add jokes about the farmer's daughter. The Sears catalogue adding excitement to the rural folks lives as they placed their order & traveled to town to pick up their goodies, add the special use in the outhouse. Then came the Eisenhower road system which allowed folks to travel coast to coast with relative ease, add Americans fascination with the automobiles. Then came the brick & mortar stores which were easy to get to with our new mobility. Then came Amazon & the situation we have today, in a way back to the Sears catalogue. It's cyclical.
Live respected, die regretted
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#4
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：05/30/2018 9:47 PMCopy HTML Welcome back, Knightly. Creative destruction is a vital part of not only a free market but also biology. There is no way around it that anyone has discovered thus far. Perhaps you've thought of a way to be shed of unnecessary or unsuccessful businesses or life forms? Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#5
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/02/2018 5:11 AMCopy HTML nice to see that TEA is still around. KEEP COOL
thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#6
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/02/2018 5:15 AMCopy HTML Is that some sort of code? TEA?
Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#7
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/02/2018 12:05 PMCopy HTML oops meant tae.... the experience american? well in some lingo the adjective or adverb comes after the noun.
thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#8
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/02/2018 7:42 PMCopy HTML thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#9
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/03/2018 2:39 AMCopy HTML Reply to Knightly (06/02/2018 10:42 AM) There is no reasonable doubt of maleficence in finance and other
sectors and it seems to be true that the closer a corporate entity is to the national capital or even state capitals, the more of this seems to happen. That is unavoidable, as near as I can tell, in any society...
some people will cheat. That said, capitalism
is meritocratic at it's base and movement within the socioeconomic
strata is still robust.. at least in the US, and Canada. Perhaps our Brit can provide illumination on the matter in the UK? Capitalism doesn't perfectly but it does work
reasonably well in that across the globe, poverty and starvation abject misery are declining rapidly. Before tearing something down that works reasonably well, we ought to be certain that what we're going to replace it with isn't worse. Thus far, and I'm referring mainly to last century, attempts to replace capitalism with the various flavors of marxism have been... problematic. I mean, when death tolls reach into the millions in multiple geographic locations, across multiple cultures and across time... maybe we should consider the possibility that marxism in any flavor is a bad idea. So, capitalism doesn't work perfectly. That's a reasonable statement. What works perfectly? Nothing. The main issue among the reasonable left, as near as I can tell, is that there are still poor people. As Jesus said, 'the poor will always be with us'. Harsh but it seems accurate. The question then becomes what, if anything, can we do about it? I think too many on the left assume that the poor are with us because the 'wealthy' exploit them and purposely keep them in misery. Isn't that what you think, Knightly? What evidence do you have that the assumption is true? It's a serious question. The trouble with meritocracy is that a significant percentage of people stack up at the bottom for various reasons; tragedy, circumstance, lack of ability, and as a consequence of voluntary choices. It's not clear that anything can or should be done about some of it. Give an addict or an imbecile a bunch of money and what's going to happen is they are going to lose it quickly, maybe even die. The evidence for this is clear among lottery winners and movie stars, for example. So where discussion should be, rather than is, is about what we can do and how much of it we can do without exacerbating the problem or creating new problems. Give an addict money, they're going to spend it on their addiction. Give a single mom a bunch of money for each baby she has out of wedlock and we're going to get more out of wedlock babies and the problems associated with them. These are not simple problems to deal with, if they were, we would have solved them already. You know, the habit that has recently developed wherein the left seem to automatically assume the right are nazi's or the equivalent is far more harmful than they seem to realize. Faced with the relentless hostility and slanderous accusations, those on the right are beginning to retaliate in kind and the thing the left wing doesn't seem to understand is that the right are well organized and well armed and not nearly as stupid as the left seems to believe. Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#10
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/04/2018 5:50 AMCopy HTML Ricardo's definition is: "Capital is that part of the wealth of a country which is employed in production, and consists of food, clothing, tools, raw materials, machinery, etc., necessary to give effect to labor." —Principles of Political Economy, Chap. V. you are treating capitalism as an ism, an ideology. i am talking about the use of capital. there is several types of capital. of late financial capital (banks, banksters) are calling the shots. wells fargo got caught robbing their depositors. the reason for this is because they couldn't expand off of industrial capital. i have been following white color crime for decades. the scams the banksters are creating are beyond your worst nightmare. you won't see it coming. thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#11
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/04/2018 6:42 AMCopy HTML i don't think of socialism as cure, a blueprint. some of its ideas of the use of capital is useful in creating wealth. the problem with capitalism. the use of capital, is the high level of corruption in the usa.
thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#12
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/04/2018 6:54 AMCopy HTML you
are treating capitalism as an ism, an ideology. i am talking about the
use of capital. there is several types of capital. of late financial
capital (banks, banksters) are calling the shots. wells fargo got caught
robbing their depositors. the reason for this is because they couldn't
expand off of industrial capital. i have been following white color
crime for decades. the scams the banksters are creating are beyond your
worst nightmare. you won't see it coming. Fair enough, thank you for the clarification, you are correct, I think of the word, 'capitalism', as an attempt to give 'free market' a more sinister tone. A fairly free market economy is a fantastic way of 'bringing peace to the galaxy'... to borrow a star wars quote... and don't perceive it as a problem. And I agree with you, there is a lot of shady as fuck stuff going on within high finance. But think of this... you seem to believe something like Wells Fargo is an all powerful monstrosity out to destroy the world. Fair enough. But they got caught and were punished... both legally and by 'the market'. So... they're not 'all that'. Perhaps you'll suggest that W.F. was merely the tip of the iceberg and incompetent, to boot. That's possible, certainly. It's no secret that private industry thinks circles around government employees. Finance is the most regulated industry we have yet they routinely make fools of the feds... until they get caught. That they 'get caught' and punished suggests that as horrible as you seem to think they are... they still ultimately answer to the guns of the government. I don't like that bush and obama bailed out the big banks. I don't like the federal reserve system and I think that, like religion, a separation of government and currency would be a good thing. I think crypto currencies are an attempt to separate government and money and, well, we'll see how that goes. As far as, 'beyond my worst nightmare', goes... well, I've a passing acquaintance with human history. "Banks" and "banksters" didn't create unit 731. They didn't create the tuskegee experiment. The federal reserve did create the great depression and keep it going in this country far longer than was necessary but the fed is a government agency, at its root. Horror beyond my imagination? Yeah, nah. The origins of my worst nightmares are found in tyrannical governments... not white collar douchebags. Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#13
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/10/2018 6:07 AMCopy HTML sometimes you and i agree on things... will small wonders ever cease?
capitalistic and socialistic are merely labels. i am interested in what works, regardless of the label. thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#14
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/14/2018 7:39 AMCopy HTML Reply to Knightly (06/09/2018 9:07 PM) sometimes you and i agree on things... will small wonders ever cease? capitalistic and socialistic are merely labels. i am interested in what works, regardless of the label. Labels are important otherwise you have know way of knowing whether your about to chug a beer or a bottle of clorox. Of the two mentioned, free market/limited government is the winner by far.
Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Knightly
|
Share to:
#15
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/19/2018 1:16 AMCopy HTML sometimes it is nice just to talk. those politcal sites are a bit odd. some come to socialize. the form it takes often bickering.
have you seen any polar bears in the wild? i did see a deer once. it was on the freeway. but i think it got hit by a car. i got a glimpse of it. couple of seconds latter, i saw a dead deer road kill. i wonder if anyone took it for deer meat. thinking is a dangerous thing
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#16
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：06/19/2018 2:34 AMCopy HTML Reply to Knightly (06/18/2018 4:16 PM)
sometimes it is nice just
to talk. those politcal sites are a bit odd. some come to socialize.
the form it takes often bickering. Seems like nothing but bickering, most times anymore. have you seen any
polar bears in the wild? Nope, they live way north of here. I've been charged by brown bears and saw a young black bear this morning. Moose are regulars and a porcupine waddles by from time to time. i did see a deer once. it was on the freeway.
but i think it got hit by a car. i got a glimpse of it. couple of
seconds latter, i saw a dead deer road kill. i wonder if anyone took it
for deer meat. Road kills here are salvaged. People put their names on a list and when a moose or caribou is hit, they have an hour or two to come collect the carcass. Quite a lot of meat on a moose... they're bigger than they look. Caribou are surprisingly small. Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Nickel
|
Share to:
#17
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：08/31/2018 5:54 AMCopy HTML Survival of the fittest, capitalism works.
Unfortunately, collusion is tough to prove, people working for bad decision makers suffer, and the big guys still edge out competition Every chance they get.
Capitalism is an efficient and effective servant of the consumer.
Workers suffer because there’s always someone who will do the job for less money and capitalists hire them. Profit motivated as they are they will pay for skills what the market bear just as they sell at what it will bear.
What goes around, comes around.
|
|
govols
|
Share to:
#18
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：08/31/2018 5:27 PMCopy HTML Marx's main criticism (I think) of capitalism boils down to two formulas: Capital - Labor - More Capital Labor - Capital - More Labor So basically "The Capitalist" uses labor (yes, he pays them...as little as possible) to make more Capital. Labor builds stuff, gets payed, consumes the resultant earnings, and them works more. Most of the working class spends most of its labor earning money to buy stuff that, once consumed, is gone forever. Even given all of the wealth that that humans have created, the vast majority of humans are still merely subsisting. Yes, in relative luxury when compared to previous generations, but still basically consuming everything we can scrape together. Except "The Capitalists." That was Marx's major observation, as near as I can tell. It seems to be true, and it seems to be a valid criticism. You seem to hold Jordan Peterson in high regard, Ak; one of his primary points is to pick up your fucking burdons and carry them...WELL. When coupled with another of his axioms--aim correctly toward a higher good--it would be corrective if applied to "The Capitalists." If all of the massively wealthy, men and women who have built empires and fortunes, paid their employees as much as possible rather than as little--instead of founding trusts that carry the family name--that would go far toward equaling those two models above. |
|
govols
|
Share to:
#19
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：08/31/2018 5:36 PMCopy HTML God help me, I just wrote positively about Karl Marx. |
|
Nickel
|
Share to:
#20
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/01/2018 12:12 AMCopy HTML LOL
Marx was unaware of how much abuse the average man will endure for the sake of his family.
We’re it not for the surplus of capable workers, wage slavery wouldn’t exist.
The high and mighty in my community could pay $10 an hour, the wage it was determined to live here without charitable or government support. They pay $5 an hour. In order to keep from paying more, they head off activists recruiting companies by joining the surfacing economic development groups. They recently touted $7 an hour jobs they recruited while turning away, discouraging companies with $15 an hour jobs. Why? Because they want the cream of the crop employees for themselves and don’t mind competing with $7 jobs, but $15 would place them at too much of a disadvantage. Sickening isn’t it, how easily the community praised them for their good work.
What goes around, comes around.
|
|
govols
|
Share to:
#21
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/05/2018 11:43 PMCopy HTML Bumping to ask Ak to comment on my above remarks about Marx. |
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#22
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/06/2018 12:20 PMCopy HTML Marx's main criticism (I think) of capitalism boils down to two formulas: Capital - Labor - More Capital Labor - Capital - More Labor So basically "The Capitalist" uses labor (yes, he pays them...as little as possible) to make more Capital. Labor builds stuff, gets payed, consumes the resultant earnings, and them works more. Most of the working class spends most of its labor earning money to buy stuff that, once consumed, is gone forever. Even given all of the wealth that that humans have created, the vast majority of humans are still merely subsisting. Yes, in relative luxury when compared to previous generations, but still basically consuming everything we can scrape together. Except "The Capitalists." That was Marx's major observation, as near as I can tell. It seems to be true, and it seems to be a valid criticism. You seem to hold Jordan Peterson in high regard, Ak; one of his primary points is to pick up your fucking burdons and carry them...WELL. When coupled with another of his axioms--aim correctly toward a higher good--it would be corrective if applied to "The Capitalists." If all of the massively wealthy, men and women who have built empires and fortunes, paid their employees as much as possible rather than as little--instead of founding trusts that carry the family name--that would go far toward equaling those two models above. Okay. Some thoughts occur and the first is; It's not that simple. Marx's idea of 'class struggle' between the haves and have nots may have been more relevent prior to the enlightenment and the rise of free-ish markets. When the world was cursed with kings and nobles and the like, sure. Marx's us vs them narrative held some water.
There is another thing here, Govols... this underlying tone attached to, 'capitalists'. Sure. Some got where they were by cheating. No one denies that. Most, however, got where they got by being intelligent, unbelieveably hard working and helping others. Yes. Helping others. Absolutely, as a group capitalists should be observed and scrutinized. However, as a group they have raised the world several rungs on the ladder out of abject poverty. Contrast that to pretty much any government currently in existance. Contrast that to any politician, past or present. Regarding Peterson's admonishment to "pick up your burdens and bear them", sure... sounds harsh. But the opposite is to do nothing and what do you accomplish by that? It doesn't make your life better. It doesn't make anyone elses life better. Not stepping up is actually worse than merely, 'not making things better'... not carrying your own burdens makes things worse not only for yourself but also for those around you. Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
Nickel
|
Share to:
#23
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/07/2018 7:11 PMCopy HTML Well said, alaskaone!
I earnestly appreciate your balanced view of capitalists and Peterson!
What goes around, comes around.
|
|
WRS10
|
Share to:
#24
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/07/2018 7:48 PMCopy HTML As the old line goes "Capitalism is the exploitation of man by Man. Marxism is the other way around!"
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#25
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/07/2018 7:53 PMCopy HTML I would counter that marxism is the exploitation of man by the state.
Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
|
alaskaone
|
Share to:
#26
|
|
Re：Why Capitalism doesn't work! Date Posted：09/25/2018 5:45 AMCopy HTML Come to the Dark Side.
We have cookies.
The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian
There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.”
― H.L. Mencken
|
You'll never get out of this world alive
Copyright © 2000- Aimoo Free Forum All rights reserved.
You must have never worked in corporate America.
The private equity firms own the CEO. The CEO is like the...trusted servant. Given ~$1-20 million to basically keep a check on the employees and of course, the senior VPs.
PE then forms a board, in which they might invite the CEO and a few other big investors they roped in. The board oversees any major mergers and acquisitions, and otherwise do nothing but detail the so called "high level strategy", which is usually all about "risk mitigation" "EBITDA" more "EBITDA" and "growth".
The CEO and all the VPs work on so called 'metrics'. These 'metrics' are simply numbers pulled out of the board's ass related to 'expected growth' and 'profit'. Pay is conducted on a % basis, where various 'metrics' or 'goals' are ranked in priority and given a weight. While the CEO may make 'only' $200k to $2million in income, their bonuses are sometimes up to 500% their annual salary.
The 'metrics' are easily faked. Firing employees, offshoring, replacing full time with part time, M&As, all temporarily boost numbers, which is why CEOs rarely stay more than a decade at any one company. And even then, getting in with the board often pays off, even if the company is doing terribly.
You know what else the CEO can do? Suppress the salaries of the rank and file, and they do so all the time. Its been documented NUMEROUS occasions. It even gets to the point where company CEOs call each other to suppress wages across the board.
Or do you like getting fucked in the ass for $50k a year?
https://www.zerohedge.com/comment/11770737#comment-11770737