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alaskaone
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Date Posted:03/06/2009 9:28 AMCopy HTML

I'm just so curious about that.  Here is a program funded by a flat tax on the poorest demographic, the proceeds of which are given to the wealthiest demographic... and hardly anyone objects.

Welfare money is collected by a tax on working people, some of the proceeds of which go to non-working people, i.e., people on welfare.

It's true that the feds have lied about SS from the very beginning back in 1935.  First they said it was like 'insurance'.  That's even what they called it at first, "Old Age Insurance".  Today, 85+ years later, SS still lies about it's own nature; we're told we each have an account from which we'll get such and such an amount when we're old.

But the supreme court of the US has ruled... not once but twice... that no one has any such thing.  Since the Supreme Court ranks higher than the SS administration, that means SS is lying.

Why is most everyone so reluctant to call a spade, "a spade"?  Is it because they would have to admit and accept that they've been defrauded?  Cheated?  Is it because of the shame that normal people would feel for being on welfare?

I don't see that being ashamed of being on welfare when, in fact, you were tricked into it is necessary.  Good grief, several generations have been tricked, lied to... conned.

So why is it no one will admit that SS is welfare?
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #61
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:23 AMCopy HTML

IN a field one summer’s day a Grasshopper was hopping about, chirping and singing to its heart’s content. An Ant passed by, bearing along with great toil an ear of corn he was taking to the nest.  1
  “Why not come and chat with me,” said the Grasshopper, “instead of toiling and moiling in that way?”  2
  “I am helping to lay up food for the winter,” said the Ant, “and recommend you to do the same.”  3
  “Why bother about winter?” said the Grasshopper; “we have got plenty of food at present.” But the Ant went on its way and continued its toil. When the winter came the Grasshopper had no food, and found itself dying of hunger, while it saw the ants distributing every day corn and grain from the stores they had collected in the summer. Then the Grasshopper knew:
Note – grasshoppers live for months.  Worker ants live for weeks. 
nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #62
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:35 AMCopy HTML

Were I to stear the boat, I'd means test SS and wind it down... fulfil obligations to those who really, really need it and let the kids know that they need to plan for their own futures. 

Then why would you save anything on the books?  We need to get rid of SS and if needed let people know they will have to go on welfare.  At one time this was a deterrent.
 
 I would stop taxing interest income,  stop taxing investments, stop inflating the dollar and scale back the federal government to pre-income tax levels while using the surplus to pay off the federal debt and fulfill obligations.

 Go ahead and say it.  Never tax productivity.  This taxing people for working and saving, the things we want and need them to do, needs to stop.

nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #63
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:38 AMCopy HTML

Kinda like forced savings. 

But no one is saving the money.  The government spends every penny it can get its hands on the then extra.  Limit government’s revenues and it may reduce spending.  As it is now every dollar they take only increases the debt. 

nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #64
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:42 AMCopy HTML

why should workers save for retirement when they aren't going to live long enough to collect?

We are doubling our knowledge of medicine every six years.  It is possible that people who are alive now may live to be a 1000 years old.  

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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:46 AMCopy HTML

The 11 million people who receive Social Security disability face steep benefit cuts next year — unless Congress acts, the government said Wednesday.

The trustees that oversee Social Security said the disability trust fund will run out of money in late 2016, right in the middle of a presidential campaign. That would trigger an automatic 19% cut in benefits
...
The trustees said the retirement fund has enough money to pay full benefits until 2035, a year later than last year's report. At that point, Social Security will collect enough in payroll taxes to pay about 75% of benefits.

There is no money in the trust funds.  There are only IOU’s.  We need to stop repeating these lies.

nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #66
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 12:57 AMCopy HTML

Well, I guess you could call it welfare but only after you receive more $ than you put in. It is a Ponzi scheme & somehow old white guys think they deserve everything they get. I'm not giving it back either.

Most people on SS now got everything they put into it plus interest in the first three years of receiving benefits. Now they are receiving the next few generations’ money.   So thank your kids and you grandkids now for the hardship that you are going to put them though because you want to be to be a deadbeat all your life.  

alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #67
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 1:55 AMCopy HTML

Reply to nofencesfacing (08/02/2015 7:11 AM)

Still waiting for your address... got a mod of about 89 prisoners for you to take care of.

I will be glad to.

Awesome!  And you're going to do it for free, right?  After all... that's what you're sniveling about, isn't it?  That I don't work for free?

<!--?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /-->Alaska is a welfare state.  For you to accept your welfare check from your welfare state because Alaska has come up with some convoluted story to justify it is depraved.  It is long past time for you to become a productive member of society and pull your own weight.        


Alaska is a banana republic owned primarily by DC.  What land is under our control, we have exchanged sub-surface property rights for commonwealth rights... meaning we get a share in sub-surface revenue regardless of whether it's on land we own personally or not.

As a state, we can do this and so far few folks have a problem with it.

In order to level the income of very cyclical revenues, we've created a permanent fund... currently worth about $50 billion.  In order to protect that fund from looting by Juneau, we've given every Alaskan resident 1 share in it... which produces an annual dividend.

In other words, NFF, despite the hamfisted, arbitrary and capricious behavior of Unka Sam, Alaska is quite wealthy and among the free-est states in the union.

Your jealousy is ignorant and ugly.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #68
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 1:59 AMCopy HTML

Reply to katie5445 (08/02/2015 8:08 AM)

Alaska works that is not welfare even if it is from the govt. Welfare would be the $1800 plus check I read they received in oil royalties last year, does AK have a job with an oil company as well?

Alaska is a commonwealth, Katie.  Meaning, in exchange for giving up sub-surface property rights, Alaskans own Alaska.  Well, what's left over after the feds had their way with us.

With natural resource revenue, we created a permanent fund, currently worth over $50 billion and each of us has one share in that fund.

How, I wonder, is that 'welfare'?
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #69
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 2:13 AMCopy HTML

Reply to katie5445 (08/02/2015 8:44 AM)

Yes I know and he gets alot of flak for working for an institution he claims is going to end the US, still in all he works.
I do not work for the federal government.  Never have and never will.

I think the word is hypocrite and of course he could have chosen another field, he expects the poor to get educated and "better" themselves and I am sure there were plenty of opportunities for him to do so as well in the good ole USA where any man can achieve the American dream if they try
This remains true... albeit much less so today than 30 years ago.

.......you either stand for something or you stand for nothing or put your money where your mouth is. His bashing of the govt. and govt. services is extremely unimpressive.

You choose not to acknowledge that state governments are not the federal government.  Many people are like that which, I suppose, is how the 17th amendment ever got passed.

A state government, like Oregon, may choose to become a communist utopia.  I'm okay with their right to give it a try even if I'm not optimistic about the outcome.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
tommytalldog Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #70
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 10:54 AMCopy HTML

So now you see fit to differentiate between federal & state governments? Your $ comes from the taxpayers & is dispensed thru the government. You whine like a spoiled child while still being on the teat for survival. Hypocrite seems to fit nicely. Your current job gives you lots of free time & ample opportunity to spout your philosophy stolen from other like thinkers. Just be thankful for the opportunity, play they game the way "they" do, & spend your time plotting on what you will do with the $ when retirement time comes around. Reality trumps idealism every time.


Tdog

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alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #71
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 1:03 PMCopy HTML


Reply to tommytalldog (08/03/2015 1:54 AM)

So now you see fit to differentiate between federal & state governments?

I have always differentiated.

Your $ comes from the taxpayers & is dispensed thru the government.

There are no income taxes in Alaska.

You whine like a spoiled child while still being on the teat for survival.

If I did not do this job, I would do another.

Hypocrite seems to fit nicely. Your current job gives you lots of free time & ample opportunity to spout your philosophy stolen from other like thinkers.

You are quite the whiny bitch this morning, T-dog.

Just be thankful for the opportunity, play they game the way "they" do, & spend your time plotting on what you will do with the $ when retirement time comes around. Reality trumps idealism every time.

Maybe.

Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 1:43 PMCopy HTML

Still waiting for your address... got a mod of about 89 prisoners for you to take care of.

I will be glad to.

Awesome!  And you're going to do it for free, right?  After all... that's what you're sniveling about, isn't it?  That I don't work for free?

First, I was glad to address that you were a deadbeat.  Next, I am not saying you work for free.  I saying we could use you in the real world.  There are plenty of deadbeats/state “workers” available to replace you in your job.  We just want government as small as it can be.  Your, I want a small government but I will gladly take a government job economic theory shows your lack of knowledge of economics and or lack of scruples.  

Then you are working for the federal government because that is where the money is coming from to pay your salary and to pay you your welfare check that you try to pass off as a refund from the state.  It will continue to be that way until Alaska gets off welfare. 

Alaska is a banana republic owned primarily by DC.  What land is under our control, we have exchanged sub-surface property rights for commonwealth rights... meaning we get a share in sub-surface revenue regardless of whether it's on land we own personally or not.

Other sates have less land, fewer natural resources but more people than Alaska but they do not need the federal government subsidizing them.  They pay into the federal government more than they get back in government spending.  It is time Alaska get off welfare and become a real state. But that is a great story to try and dodging responsibility.  We, in the real states, see through you convoluted story and are calling you out.       

You are on welfare and can't admit it.

tommytalldog Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #73
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/03/2015 2:13 PMCopy HTML

Reply to alaskaone (08/03/2015 7:03 AM)


Reply to tommytalldog (08/03/2015 1:54 AM)

So now you see fit to differentiate between federal & state governments?

I have always differentiated.

Your $ comes from the taxpayers & is dispensed thru the government.

There are no income taxes in Alaska.

You whine like a spoiled child while still being on the teat for survival.

If I did not do this job, I would do another.

Hypocrite seems to fit nicely. Your current job gives you lots of free time & ample opportunity to spout your philosophy stolen from other like thinkers.

You are quite the whiny bitch this morning, T-dog.

Just be thankful for the opportunity, play they game the way "they" do, & spend your time plotting on what you will do with the $ when retirement time comes around. Reality trumps idealism every time.

Maybe.

Alaska has no income taxes but subsidies from the feds. You could do another but choose not to. Perhaps the ease of the current job, perhaps you like control, perhaps you are too lazy or scared to leave now that you have seniority. I have toxic shock syndrome this AM. No maybe about it, AK.


Tdog



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Nickel Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #74
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/04/2015 5:04 PMCopy HTML

 Social Security is not welfare.  It is no longer just for old age; it also takes care of widows and orphans.  It is paid for by the recipients if they live long enough to collect, by their widows and orphans if they don't.  A recipient must qualify, not everyone can collect ss.  Some state workers, etc., opted out of social security back in the day, and understandably campaign vigorously against the program, now, since they will never be eligible.  Since there is a cap for the rich, which would make the the program solvent way into the future, the rich should not be able to qualify.  Recipients today paid what was asked, and that wasn't enough for the boomer generation now approaching retirement age.  I was cheated out of a year of benefits because they changed the qualifying year to 66 from 65 which it was when I started paying into the system.  Future generations should be asked to pay what is needed for them instead of pay as you go since population varies.  Another boomer generation follows, so the change could be simple, hardly noticeable.

Social Security has a widespread stabilizing impact on the country because seniors collecting it keep local businesses offering basic goods and sevices operating despite downturns in a local economy.  Businesses with a senior workforce can more easily fill retiree positions with younger, cheaper employees.  Seniors are more comfortable retiring with social security to fall back on than their own insurance and retirement plans.  The stock market is a gamble...most know you should only invest what you can afford to lose.

If you are a caregiver, you know the extraordinary demands of a senior in your home and the outrageous costs of care facilities.  How many families today can take in the widows and orphans left by the death of wage earner?  Even with Social Security you may be burdened by them in your home and find that it is not enough for the lifestyle that senior wants or the widow and orphan is accustomed.

Thank FDR!  Social security is a great benefit providing for the general welfare of the country.


What goes around, comes around.
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #75
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/05/2015 12:24 AMCopy HTML

Reply to alaskaone (08/02/2015 6:59 PM)

Reply to katie5445 (08/02/2015 8:08 AM)

Alaska works that is not welfare even if it is from the govt. Welfare would be the $1800 plus check I read they received in oil royalties last year, does AK have a job with an oil company as well?

Alaska is a commonwealth, Katie.  Meaning, in exchange for giving up sub-surface property rights, Alaskans own Alaska.  Well, what's left over after the feds had their way with us.

With natural resource revenue, we created a permanent fund, currently worth over $50 billion and each of us has one share in that fund.

How, I wonder, is that 'welfare'?

And I funded SS.
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #76
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/05/2015 1:58 AMCopy HTML

Reply to katie5445 (08/04/2015 3:24 PM)

And I funded SS.

No.  I'm sorry.  You paid taxes. 
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/05/2015 11:13 AMCopy HTML

Yes, all of us who paid taxes are patriots.


Tdog

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Segovia_del_Prado Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #78
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/07/2015 1:12 PMCopy HTML

 If all subsurface mining/drilling rights belong to the state to be distributed among the citizens of the state;

why in HELL would I, as the owner of the surface property, allow any mining/drilling on my property?

You people need to kick the federal government out of your state and take back your resources, then I suspect you wouldn't need the subsidies from the feds.  Grow a set an elect some fighters.
“The truth is like a lion, you don’t have to defend it. Let it loose, it will defend itself.” St. Augustine
alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #79
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/07/2015 6:18 PMCopy HTML

 Most of the "subsidies" these knuckleheads are sniveling about are the military bases in Alaska and highway funds which they also receive... except in far vaster quantity.  Some states tried to keep the federal government out a while back, resulted in 600,000 deaths and uncounted maimed. 
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/08/2015 4:17 AMCopy HTML

why in HELL would I, as the owner of the surface property, allow any mining/drilling on my property?

The property is owned by the US government.  So you are part owner.  This is an asset to offset some of the debt caused by people like alaskaone who "work" for the government and who are also on welfare. 

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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/08/2015 4:23 AMCopy HTML

Most of the "subsidies" these knuckleheads are sniveling about are the military bases in Alaska and highway funds which they also receive... except in far vaster quantity.

 

And how are the government welfare “jobs” on military bases different from your government welfare “job”?   How much welfare does your state need? 

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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/08/2015 6:27 AMCopy HTML

Reply to nofencesfacing (08/07/2015 7:23 PM)

Most of the "subsidies" these knuckleheads are sniveling about are the military bases in <!--?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /-->Alaska and highway funds which they also receive... except in far vaster quantity.<!--?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /-->

 

And how are the government welfare “jobs” on military bases different from your government welfare “job”?   How much welfare does your state need? 


You're just desperately trolling now but I have a moment so I'll indulge you for my own entertainment.

#1)  Working for compensation is not welfare.

#2)  One of the few tasks actually given to the federal government is national defense thus a standing army is authorized even if it isn't the greatest idea in the world.

#3)  Less than 1% of Alaska land is owned privately.  Most is claimed by the feds in violation of the agreement AK made when it sought statehood.  The second largest land owner in Alaska is the state, the third largest are AK native lands.

#4)  Until the feds honor their promises to us, we will continue to soak the treasury for every penny we can get*... which is exactly what every other state in the union does.  For instance, the most famous example of federal hostility and interference is the aborted Pebble mine project wherein the EPA denied the permit prior to doing any homework on the matter.

In other words, the EPA arbitrarily decided the land owners couldn't mine on their own property just because... well, just because the EPA goons think "mining = bad".



*This is perhaps the largest 'tragedy of the commons' scenario the world has ever seen and it will eventually end very, very badly.

Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #83
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/08/2015 1:38 PMCopy HTML

#1)  Working for compensation is not welfare.

So when the government runs up the national debit the “jobs” the deficit spending creates are real jobs?  Well then in that case there is noting wrong with the government wasting money so you can take down your “-$124 trillion in debt/liabilities and growing fast”.

#2)  One of the few tasks actually given to the federal government is national defense thus a standing army is authorized even if it isn't the greatest idea in the world.

Then everything we waste on defense spending has nothing to do with enabling other countries to cut their defense spending because the US is paying for their defense?  Also, there is no military industrial complex?


#3)  Less than 1% of Alaska land is owned privately.  Most is claimed by the feds in violation of the agreement AK made when it sought statehood.  The second largest land owner in Alaska is the state, the third largest are AK native lands.

 

The taxpayers bought the land until you buy these holdings from the federal government you have no rights to them.  That is the case in many states. 

So have your state sell the land the state owns.  You do vote in state elections don’t you? 

The natives owned all the land before it was taken away from them.

All these things have to do with the real world.  You should get out in the real world and see what it is like. 


#4)  Until the feds honor their promises to us, we will continue to soak the treasury for every penny we can get*... which is exactly what every other state in the union does.  For instance, the most famous example of federal hostility and interference is the aborted Pebble mine project wherein the EPA denied the permit prior to doing any homework on the matter.

In other words, the EPA arbitrarily decided the land owners couldn't mine on their own property just because... well, just because the EPA goons think "mining = bad".

Well you can sit there collecting your welfare are you could do things like get out and vote and try to improve the world around you.

tommytalldog Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #84
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/08/2015 4:27 PMCopy HTML

C'mon now, Fence. You are beating a dead horse here with this tedious AK is on welfare shtick. I rarely agree with AK but he exchanges his time for a wage & that is hardly welfare. I get your point & am sure that other members do as well.


Tdog

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nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #85
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/09/2015 2:51 AMCopy HTML

C'mon now, Fence. You are beating a dead horse here with this tedious AK is on welfare shtick. I rarely agree with AK but he exchanges his time for a wage & that is hardly welfare. I get your point & am sure that other members do as well.

You are joking right?  We owe/are liable for will over $100 trillion.  We have to cut government spending.  Even if it means we no longer get to imprison more of our people than any other country.  Government spending does mean we have more government jobs but like all wasteful spending they are not needed and even the great American we can no longer afford them.  The next few generations are sorry but they have to tell the alaskaones of the world find real jobs.   

 

That is unless you are willing to come up with $120 trillion.

alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #86
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/09/2015 4:59 AMCopy HTML

Reply to nofencesfacing (08/08/2015 5:51 PM)

You are joking right?  We owe/are liable for will over $100 trillion.  We have to cut government spending.  Even if it means we no longer get to imprison more of our people than any other country.

The largest federal expenditures are, from largest to smallest:  social security, medicaid, "defense" spending and interest upon the debt. There are, of course, hundreds of other federal agencies sipping at the federal treasury but those are the largest.


Government spending does mean we have more government jobs but like all wasteful spending they are not needed and even the great American we can no longer afford them.

I agree.  However wages and benefits of federal employees, while substantial, are not where the bulk of federal spending goes.


The next few generations are sorry but they have to tell the alaskaones of the world find real jobs.

Your hatred of me is making you irrational.  Well, more irrational.  Or are you proposing that all criminals simply be shot and killed on sight?  As tempting as that might sound to an irrational simpleton, the real world is a tad more complex.


"Now I did a job. Got nothing but trouble since I did it. Not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character. So let me make this abundantly clear: I do the job. And then I get paid."~ Malcom Reynolds

 

That is unless you are willing to come up with $120 trillion.

The figure is, as you should know, a guess at the unfunded liabilities of ss/medicare.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #87
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/09/2015 1:53 PMCopy HTML

You are joking right?  We owe/are liable for will over $100 trillion.  We have to cut government spending.  Even if it means we no longer get to imprison more of our people than any other country.

The largest federal expenditures are, from largest to smallest:  social security, medicaid, "defense" spending and interest upon the debt. There are, of course, hundreds of other federal agencies sipping at the federal treasury but those are the largest..

 

So, except for your welfare payment of course, you agree that we must cut every penny of government waste?

 

Government spending does mean we have more government jobs but like all wasteful spending they are not needed and even the great American we can no longer afford them.

I agree.  However wages and benefits of federal employees, while substantial, are not where the bulk of federal spending goes.

 

So, except for your welfare payment of course, you agree that we must cut every penny of government waste?

 

The next few generations are sorry but they have to tell the alaskaones of the world find real jobs.

Your hatred of me is making you irrational.  Well, more irrational.  Or are you proposing that all criminals simply be shot and killed on sight?  As tempting as that might sound to an irrational simpleton, the real world is a tad more complex.

 

I proposing we do not need to have the world’s largest prison systems in the world.  Talk about government waste.


"Now I did a job. Got nothing but trouble since I did it. Not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character. So let me make this abundantly clear: I do the job. And then I get paid."~ Malcom Reynolds

 

If it was a job that involves government waste then it is not a real job.  It is just another welfares program.

 

That is unless you are willing to come up with $120 trillion.

The figure is, as you should know, a guess at the unfunded liabilities of ss/medicare.

 

See above, “We owe/are liable for will over $100 trillion“.  Remember I am the one who told you about the massive unfunded liabilities.  Before that you were complaining just about the national debt.  I had to inform you about the real world.

alaskaone Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #88
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/10/2015 1:41 AMCopy HTML

 Dude, seek help.
Come to the Dark Side. We have cookies. The advantage of insinuations over hard arguments is that they bypass critical thought. No one can respond precisely to a charge that is utterly vague or to accusers who will envelope any reply in a poisonous fog of further insinuations. ~ David Warren, The Guardian There was a time when there was enough freedom that it hardly mattered which brand of crooks ran government. That has not been true for a long time and that captures an important point. The more powerful the government becomes, the more people are willing to do in order to seize the prize, and the more afraid they become when someone else has control. ~ Glenn Harlan Reynolds “The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” ― H.L. Mencken
nofencesfacing Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #89
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/10/2015 1:49 PMCopy HTML

Deadbeat get a job.  That will help the next few generations.
katie5445 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #90
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Re:Why can't people admit that social security is welfare?

Date Posted:08/10/2015 6:46 PMCopy HTML

Around 25 yrs. ago widows receiving SS got several hundred dollars a month, even for 25 yrs. ago a non livable income, they were further supported by cash aid, medicare was supplemented by medicaid and food stamps. If you receive the max as a widow now which it is  $2663 it is a livable income sans any welfare, works for me.
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